Jump to content
Sign in to follow this  


Recommended Posts

Kaksi artikkelia, jotka hyvin kuvaa sitä miten jakautunut Arsenalin kannattajakunta on.



Arsenal Circular 153 – Arsene should not be judged on 2005 to 2013

By Graham Perry

Yet no other club faced with Arsenal financial restraints could have performed as well as the Gunners managed

Fans still very split – some of us really want Wenger to succeed and hope that his summer purchases will bring us success. Some really want Wenger to fail and hope that the buys will trigger his departure.


Arsene - Media are loving the civil war between fans

The media are loving it. They want “fan fury” and discord and confrontation and protest. They fan the flames by provocative headlines intended to encourage protest and complaint. The media do well – financially – when there is crisis and brinkmanship – when parties and fans are at locked in combat.

We have a choice – we don’t have to play into the hands of the media. We can keep our commitment to the manager and the team and shout “Arsenal” from the roof tops. But it won’t happen. The differences run too deep – the animosity and the support for Wenger are there and the press want us at each other’s throats.

My position has always been clear. I rate him highly, want him to succeed. I accept that things have gone wrong in the sense that last year should have been our year but I read all the anti-articles whether by knee-jerk haters (of which there are many) or more refined columnists fingering the nails for Arsene’s crucifixion. Arsenal FC is different from other clubs. Arsene is different from other managers. We do not need histrionics on the touchline in the mistaken belief that it adds another 5% to the performance of the team. We do not want to be the record breakers when it comes to transfer fees. We want ability and character and commitment and AW can convey that to his players and bring success.

And to those who are queuing up to dance on Wenger’s grave I give a word of caution – what if this season goes well? What if the new players do make a difference? What if results go our way?

Have you over-committed to the anti-Wenger attacks that success has to be undermined, even ridiculed? What if Xhaka toughens us in midfield and Perez starts as well as Alexis and Santi did and Mustafi slots into central defence and creates competition for the two centre positions. Of course it might not happen but if it does you will have to think about how you respond. Some will show intellectual honesty and praise AW for being his own man and making purchases when he wanted to and not when critical fans demanded it – others will find ways to be so begrudging in their praise that it amounts to more moans. And remember the younger players with promise – Iwobi, Bielik, Adelaide and Willock – will be challenging for places.

I know I am on a hiding to nothing. Friends have urged me to be low key but I prefer to be out front and make the case for a man who I believe still has it within him to bring success back to AFC.

I think RVP left three years ago – his departure marked the end of AFC being a selling Club. AW had kept us in the top four while selling the Crown Jewels. No other club faced with our financial restraints had performed as well as AW. Always in the top four, sometimes even challenging for honours. So Arsene should be judged not from 2005 but from 2013.

I think we are set for an exciting season. I hope the main events are on the pitch and not in the crowd. It is the performance of the team and not the organised protests of the anti-AW brigade that matters. Trite phrase I now but the proof of the pudding is in the eating. Good Luck Arsene – I hope you make it.



Wenger is football’s Tim Henman

By Mark Halfpenny

Graham Perry's latest Arsenal Circular has failed to establish a consensus...

Reading the recent article by Graham Perry, I was hoping that a Wenger supporter could put forward a convincing argument as to why he is the best man for the job. I have tried so many times to ask why some people ignore the evidence of the last 12 years but the response usually involves being told to, “Be careful what you wish for” or “Who could possibly replace him?” or my favourite, the pathetic “Piss off and support Chelsea / City / Man Utd”. Graham didn’t tell us to “Piss Off” but he may as well have done, as his article is so full of inaccuracies, wishful thinking and blindness to the facts.


Great coach?

It’s important to state at the outset that I, like every other Gooner, want Arsenal to be successful. I remember how I felt in 1989, 1991 1998, 2002 & 2004 and I want that feeling again. Sadly there is precious little evidence since 2004 (12 years and counting!) that Wenger will ever again win one of the big honours.

Graham starts by saying that “The media are loving it. They want fan fury and discord”. Sorry Graham but that is rubbish. The media report a split between Arsenal fans because there is a split between Arsenal fans. And that split is because thousands of long term fans like me have wanted Wenger out of our club for years due to his mismanagement, end of season collapses, chronic under achievement and wasteful spending on huge wages to rubbish players.

The British media are so in thrall to Wenger that he gets by far the easiest treatment of any top manager. Last Christmas, we were humiliated 4-0 by Southampton and on the same day Man Utd lost 2-0 to Stoke. All of the talk on Match of the Day, Sky and the printed media was how Van Gaal couldn’t possibly survive another defeat but the analysis of our match didn’t feature Wenger’s shortcomings at all.

It was “They lacked leadership” “The players let Arsene down” or “two or three more signings” - totally ignoring the fact that Wenger and Wenger alone is responsible for assembling the squad, picking and motivating the team, selecting the formation and managing each match as it progresses. In 95% of our media, it’s never Wenger’s fault. No other manager gets treated like this. It was exactly the same after the 8-2 at Old Trafford or the 6-0 at Chelsea or the regular thrashings in the Champions League Last 16.

Graham goes on to say that we should not judge Wenger on 2005 – 2013 and we should“shout Arsenal from the roof tops”. Why should I Graham? I’ve followed the team home, away and in Europe since the late 70s, spending thousands of pounds and thousands of hours. It was a huge part of my life and I sang myself hoarse in many a losing battle. But in late 2010 I gave up.

I sat through match after match, paying nearly £100 a time (well over £2,000 a year) to watch Eboue, Song, Squillaci, Bendtner, Denilson, Almunia, Gervinho, Walcott and many others poncing about, whilst collecting £50 or £60,000 a week. And all the while, Wenger sat on the bench fiddling with his zip. Wenger has had more money than most clubs – he just chose to spend it on too many sub standard players. Having paid thousands myself Graham, I have every right to judge the utter rubbish served up from 2005 onwards.

And that leads on to another glaring inaccuracy in Graham’s article – he tries to claim “No other club faced with our financial restraints had performed as well as AW”.

Sorry Graham but that is garbage. When Malcom Glazer took full control of Manchester United in May 2005, Man Utd were debt free. His takeover, however, was highly leveraged and in June 2010, Man Utd’s debts stood at £780million. That is far more debt than Arsenal ever had, and it should have been a huge barrier to success. But it wasn’t. Since 2005 Man Utd have won the League 5 times, the Champions League once, the FA Cup once and the League Cup 3 times. That shows what a ruthless manager can achieve. Furthermore, Man Utd seem to have addressed all of their weaknesses in just one transfer window, whilst Wenger once again swanned off to commentate on French TV.

Graham refers also to “knee-jerk haters”. Graham – my dislike of Wenger is built on seeing the same mistakes, hearing the same excuses, watching the same rubbish every year since 2005. It is anything but knee-jerk my old mate. I didn’t start out hating Wenger but I do now. One of many reasons why I hate him is because of the lies he tells. After the Man City friendly match on 7th August Wenger said “Physically we are ready for the new season” but after the Liverpool defeat 7 days later he said “We are not ready physically”.

When quizzed about why he is so far behind his rivals once again during this transfer window he snapped “Look at my face. Am I the face of somebody who does a panic buy?”(Oh no? What about Santos, Park, Benayoun and the permanently injured Arteta in 2011 ??)

And for years Wenger has claimed that nobody can compete with “Financially doped clubs”but this week he has stated “If you look at last season for example, it is not necessarily the club who bought the most that is in front”. The man is so arrogant and disingenuous that he will change his tune whenever it suits him and he has been doing it for years.

Graham tries also to claim that we have young players with promise. We’ve been sold that lie for years Graham or don’t you remember Merida / Lupoli / Owusu-Abayie / Vernazza / Grondin / Pennant / Emmanuel-Thomas / Aliadiere / Itonga / Randall / Bendtner / Vela / Bentley and many, many others. Wenger’s record at producing and managing young talent is woeful.

Just look at Wenger’s handling of Calum Chambers. Buys him for £16million, picks him, drops him, picks him, drops him, plays him out of position, drops him, sends him out on loan. And this is the man that Graham and co try to portray as a footballing genius.

I hesitate to get started on Graham’s “What ifs” but I can’t resist “What if results go our way?”. Everything went our way last season Graham – Chelsea were crap, City were inconsistent, United floundered, Spurs shot themselves in both feet, Liverpool played more like Blackpool but we still managed to have our usual meltdown in Spring and finish 10 points behind Leicester City. There is nothing to suggest that Wenger will ever recreate past triumphs. Even opposition fans sing “Arsene Wenger, we want you to stay”.

And then there is Wenger’s £8.3 million a year salary (whilst complaining about money in football) his defence of high ticket prices (the only Premier League manager to do so) and his dismal European record, given the funds available to him (3 European finals in 32 years of management – and all 3 ended in defeat). What is the point of finishing in the top 4 when Wenger doesn’t have what it takes to win in Europe?

To put Wenger’s European record in context - Brian Clough won the European Cup twice in four attempts, Bob Paisley three times in six, Ancelotti three times in twelve, Guardiola twice in five, Mourinho twice in eleven, Heynckes twice in five and Ferguson twice in twenty one. If Wenger was half as good as Graham wants us to believe, he wouldn’t have that glaring omission on his CV after all these years.

Wenger is football’s Tim Henman – good but there’s always someone better. He has had so much more time, money and leeway than any other top manager but still he finds a way to mess everything up, season after season. The problems at Arsenal are not the result of a media driven witch hunt. Nor are they a result of a shortage of cash. They are caused by a stubborn, arrogant, out of date manager that has too much power, is way behind his rivals and is more concerned with proving everyone wrong.

And that, Graham, is why I, and thousands of others, can’t wait until the day that Wenger finally departs our great Club.

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

When Wenger met Wright, Campbell and Gallas

Arsène Wenger speaks with ex-Arsenal pros, Ian Wright, Sol Campbell and William Gallas.

The trio discuss the boss' managerial style, revolutionary methods as well as his philosophy on the future of football management.

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Heh.. ehkä pisin teksti vuosiin mitä kirjoitin tänne foorumille ja ironisesti koira päätti surfata näppäimmistön päältä ja sensuroida kaiken. Niinhän se menee. En usko, että kovinkaan moni ymmärtää (edes/ainakaan) Arsenalin kannattajista miten paljon Arsene Wenger on antanut jalkapallolle ja Arsenalille. Melkoinen persoona, jota varmasti mukava vihata mutta kun rankalainen eläkkeelle siirtyy, jää mielestäni samanlainen tyhjiö mitä jäi SAF:n siirtyessä eläkkeelle. Mikään ei ole enää samaa. Viimeiset 5 -vuotta olen enemmän tai vähemmän ollut Wengeriä vastaan ja se on näkynyt myös tällä foorumilla. Ei vain jaksa enää kiinnostaa joukkueen esitys niin paljoa, kuin aikaisemmin. Kenties se on jonkin sortin "gloryhunterismia" tai sitten se on vain sitä, että haluaa muutosta. Haluaa erilaisia selityksiä ja haluaa muutakin, kuin sitä 2-4 sijoitusta. Olen jotenkin kyllästynyt siihen mitä jalkapallo on nykyään. Rahaa liikkuu suuntaansa, mutta oma suosikkini surffaa paikallaan samoine selityksineen. Leicesterin mestaruus oli raikas tuulahdus, mutta taas mennään samoilla kaavoilla. Kun Wenger tämän kauden (tai vähintään kolmen vuoden päästä) siirtyy viimein eläkkeelle toivon, että myös vastustajat voivat antaa Wengerille sen kunnian, jonka hän ansaitsee. Jos jokin on varmaa, niin sen jälkeen Arsenal ei ole enää entisensä. Se 2000 -luvun alun legendaarinen joukkue on lopullisesti poissa ja uusi sivu joukkueen historiikissa on viimein avattu. SE mihin se johtaa on uusi tarina, mutta ainakin itse kannattajana olen valmis sen sivun avaamaan. Toivottavasti se sivu tuo tullessaan uusia huimia tarinoita, jonka myötä myös oma rakkauteni joukkuetta kohtaan lähtee uuteen roihuun. 

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Tarkemmat informaatiot ja sopimuksen rakenne tulee ilmi myöhemmin, mutta voisi olettaa, että kyseessä on todellisuudessa vuoden jatkosopimus, johon sisällytetty toisen vuoden optio, mikä ollut huhuissa jo talvesta asti.


Ihan järkevää toimintaa. Kuten jo todettu, niin nyt huhti-toukokuussa olisi ollut aivan järjetöntä lähteä enää korvaamaan, koska valmistautuminen näin suureen muutokseen olisi ollut liian myöhäistä. Ja kuten monesti todennut, niin ensi vuonna monet managerit ovat ilman sopimusta ja mahdollisesti helpommin saatavilla.


Arsene Wenger has agreed a new two-year contract with Arsenal.


Announcement due on Wednesday:




#AFC #bbcsportsday

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Tunteella ajateltunahan tämä on melko persiistä, mutta jos onnistuttaisiin välttämään Moyes/ Van Gaal - flopit fiksulla siirtymällä, niin jatkoa ajatellen tämä saattaa olla hyvä juttu (kiva uskotella itselle, että kyllä se tästä ja elämä jatkuu). 

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Tosin Valioliigan aikaan sitten tuota vaihtuvuuttakin on tapahtunut enemmän, kun ympärillä tapahtunut paljon muutakin.

Totta. Ja, kun miettii millaiseksi huippufutis on mennyt voidaan pitää suoranaisena ihmeenä, että yksi mies voi pysyä managerina näinkin pitkään.

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

John Crossilta näkemys Arsenalin ja Arsènen tilanteeseen:

"Wenger also knows that he had to change if he wants to stay and see out the final year of his contract which expires in 2019.
So far, he is embracing that.

I keep reading that Wenger made a put down remark to Mislintat. I was at that press conference and he did no such thing, he was just talking about a new way of working and how Mislintat could find players in unexpected places.

It was a compliment, not a put down. Blimey, I saw all his rants about directors of football to knows one of those. Wenger likes the new contract guy Huss Fahmy and is clearly listening to Mislintat.

Former Barcelona director of football Raúl Sanllehí starts at Arsenal on February 1 which has meant that the outgoing transfer fixer Dick Law has worked on deals in this window.

And Aubameyang is one hell of a leaving present as he prepares to say his farewells. He helped oversee deals for Mesut Ozil, Alexis Sanchez and Aubameyang.

The times they are a changing at Arsenal and Wenger is embracing them."

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Tässä se sitten on https://www.arsenal.com/news/merci-arsene


lisää mm: https://www.theguardian.com/football/2018/apr/20/arsene-wenger-to-leave-arsenal-at-the-end-of-the-season


tässäpä myös hauska kirjoitus suosikkilehdestäni aiheesta https://www.theguardian.com/sport/blog/2013/oct/01/from-vault-arsene-wenger-joins-arsenal-mars-bars



Pakko nostaa Arsenelle hattua kaikesta huolimatta!

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Tyhjä olo, mutta oikeanlainen.

Henry Winter (Times):

David Dein invited 9 of us correspondents into Highbury board-room to meet Wenger in '96. Arsène spoke for 50 mins, and we were spellbound by his attacking philosophy, belief in nutrition (broccoli!) and obsession with Arsenal FC as a community club. A visionary had arrived.

I remember talking to Sol Campbell in Colney canteen and he demonstrated how Wenger insisted if players were to drink tea or coffee (milk bad), and if you had to have sugar, there was a Wenger-approved technique of stirring it in to make all the granules absorb. Perfectionist.

Interviewed Wenger once at Hornby’s school for kids with Autism. Wenger argued passionately that society had to appreciate these kids’ unique mind-set, their different intelligence, acute logic and work with computers tackling complex problems. Look inside GCHQ now.

Wenger always dealt with fans’ interest calmly and with a smile. Walking into the 2010 World Cup final in Soweto, he stopped maybe 60-70 times to accommodate autograph requests. Had to run the last bit to get to TV studio. Always a touch of class about Wenger.

Only saw Wenger truly well refreshed once, night before a World Cup final, when he encountered 4-5 English journalists in a restaurant well after midnight. “Ah, les Ros-bifs!” he began, and chatted away. Great company. Talks about anything sport to politics. Wry humour too.

Truly obsessed with football. On his 60th birthday, we urged him after press conference at Colney to have a night off from watching football, go see a show in the West End etc. He wanted to watch a Bundesliga game but promised to put candles on top of the TV to mark his birthday.

Compassionate man. Arsenal have a link-up with a community affected by Chernobyl and Wenger sends messages and shirts. One Ukrainian girl affected by the fall-out asked to be buried in an Arsenal track top that Wenger and Club had sent because “they were the only ones who cared”.

Two days before start of this season, Wenger dropped everything to attend an FWA event raising funds for survivors of Grenfell. Spoke passionately about society’s need to protect people better. Did great Q&A. A few WengerOuts in the room and he charmed them with his dignity. 

I spoke to a 25-year-old Arsenal supporter whose parents had separated when he was very young. He said he’d never met Wenger but would always be grateful to Wenger because he was the only stable male figure in his life. Wenger was a constant.

For a decade, Wenger’s football was glorious, innovative and attacking, and the Invincibles are legends. He let it drift, got overtaken, and surrounded himself with people who didn’t question him enough. Wenger right to go now and he deserves a statue outside the Emirates.


Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Oma elämä on kyllä tällä hetkellä täydellistä videopeliä. Seikkailen vaihteeksi Meksikossa, ja yhtäkkiä puhelin täyttyy ilmoituksilla Wengerin erosta. Olotila oli hetken hyvin haikea, mutta kyllä tätä on jo ikuisuus odotettu. Kaiken jälkeen ero tapahtuu lopulta vielä hyvin tunnelmin. Arsenal siirtyy uudelle aikakaudelle, ja samalla myös kaikki me, joille seura merkitsee jotain. Merci Arsene.

Share this post

Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this